Target Disk Mode, PPC, and Intel

[zoara]

Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).

Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?

Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

Just interested, that's all.

-zoara-

[Jon B]

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

[zoara]

Post by Jon B

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

Hmm, that's not dictated by the machine that is actually *in* target
disk mode? Doesn't it just appear on the bus as if you had an external
FW hard disk and a FW DVD writer?

And the internal hard disk wasn't appearing either. System Profiler on
the PPC machine showed nada on the bus at all (the bus itself wasn't
faulty, an attached FW disk showed up fine)

-zoara-

[Jon B]

Post by zoara

Post by Jon B

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

Hmm, that's not dictated by the machine that is actually *in* target
disk mode? Doesn't it just appear on the bus as if you had an external
FW hard disk and a FW DVD writer?
And the internal hard disk wasn't appearing either. System Profiler on
the PPC machine showed nada on the bus at all (the bus itself wasn't
faulty, an attached FW disk showed up fine)

Might help if I'd not read the question completely back to front.

I suspect the initial hunch is correct that the os9 machine doesn't know
how to handle the new partition map. What happens if you try an older
disc in the DVD drive? Will it work then?

[SimonB]

Post by Jon B

Post by zoara

Post by Jon B

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

Hmm, that's not dictated by the machine that is actually *in* target
disk mode? Doesn't it just appear on the bus as if you had an external
FW hard disk and a FW DVD writer?
And the internal hard disk wasn't appearing either. System Profiler on
the PPC machine showed nada on the bus at all (the bus itself wasn't
faulty, an attached FW disk showed up fine)

Might help if I'd not read the question completely back to front.
I suspect the initial hunch is correct that the os9 machine doesn't know
how to handle the new partition map. What happens if you try an older
disc in the DVD drive? Will it work then?

Are both disks on the same bus (internal to the target mode MBP, that
is)?
Trying to mount a machine here in target mode with both HDs on the same
ATA bus will only ever bring up the master drive -- the slave drive
doesn't show. Mind you, this is on a PPC.

[David Empson]

Post by SimonB

Post by Jon B

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other
end is a PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this
some kind of clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that
neither the internal disk nor the DVD will mount because of a lack
of drivers in OS9 for the new Intel partitioning format of the
disk and the DVD drive in question...

No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

[snip]

Post by SimonB
Are both disks on the same bus (internal to the target mode MBP, that
is)?
Trying to mount a machine here in target mode with both HDs on the same
ATA bus will only ever bring up the master drive -- the slave drive
doesn't show. Mind you, this is on a PPC.

That's the effect Jon B noted, which depends on the age of the computer
that is in target disk mode.

In models introduced prior to about 2003, target mode only gives another
computer access to the first drive on the first ATA bus.

In models introduced after about 2003, target mode gives another
computer access to all internal ATA hard drives and optical drives.

I haven't determined the exact cutoff point as I don't have access to
enough models to test them. All iBook G4s fall into the latter camp
(first model was late 2003), and all PowerMac G4s and PowerBook G4s from
2002 or earlier fall into the former camp.

[Richard Tobin]

Post by zoara

Post by Jon B
No, just the hardware at the time only supported showing the master HD.
Sharing secondary drives & optical drives was a later development.

Hmm, that's not dictated by the machine that is actually *in* target
disk mode? Doesn't it just appear on the bus as if you had an external
FW hard disk and a FW DVD writer?

The devices aren't really on a firewire bus, The target machine is
simulating that. So it depends on the software on the target machine
which devices appear on the bus.

-- Richard

[David Empson]

Post by zoara
Just curious about this one (I have another solution to my problem).
Putting a MacBook Pro in Firewire Target Disk Mode shares both the
internal disk and any disc in the optical drive to the machine on the
other end of the Firewire cable, right?

Yes. They act like a standalone hard drive and DVD drive connected to
the Firewire bus.

Post by zoara
Why does this technique not work when the computer at the other end is a
PPC machine (specifically a Cube) running OS 9.2? Is this some kind of
clash between Intel and PPC? I'm guessing that neither the internal disk
nor the DVD will mount because of a lack of drivers in OS9 for the new
Intel partitioning format of the disk and the DVD drive in question...

That's very likely as far as the hard drive is concerned. You need to be
running Tiger or later on a PPC Mac to access a hard drive partitioned
using GUID Partition Table.

It is less clear why the DVD drive isn't working. It should mount as a
simple read-only storage device, as long as the DVD/CD in the drive is
in a format supported by Mac OS 9.

You are less likely to be able to burn anything from Mac OS 9 (due to
lack of driver support).

What does Apple System Profiler say about the connected devices? It
should recognise both the hard drive and DVD drive but probably won't
say anything about the volumes they contain.